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'Trier' rose Reviews & Comments
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I note that under "hybrid musks" this rose does not show up, yet descendants such as "Plaisanterie" do.
Should this entry have the category of "hybrid 'musk'" added next to "hybrid multiflora"?
Thanks.
-Philip
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#1 of 6 posted
20 MAR 15 by
 Jay-Jay
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As far as I know, there is no Musk in this roses parentage. Lots of so-called Moschata(-hybrids/roses) don't have too. Just a few of Lens' roses have real Musk in their parentage.
And also very few other descendants of the Musk Rose group.
Except for a lot of Roses bred by Kim Rupert and Robert Neil Rippetoe. They can/might inform You better!
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I don't believe any of the historical "Hybrid 'Musks'" have R. moschata in their lineage, which I presume to be the reason HMF distinguishes b/w hybrid moschata and hybrid musk in their advanced search. Plaisanterie, for instance, is a cross between Trier and Mutabilis, but is listed herein as a hybrid musk -- a class to which Trier, as a "lambertiana", I think, has also been considered to belong.
If Trier isn't a "hybrid musk" in a newer revised sense, then its offspring certainly wouldn't be.
In fact, I just confirmed: the parentage of Plaisanterie is herein listed as:
Trier (Hybrid Musk, Lambert, 1904) × Mutabilis (china, Unknown, before 1894)
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#3 of 6 posted
20 MAR 15 by
Jay-Jay
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Most of the so-called musk-hybrids might have more or less a scent (described) as musk... most of them are offspring of Multiflora and its Hybrids.
PS: 'Musquée sans Soucis' is a repeat/continuous flowering descendant of a REAL Musk Rose.
...Looking, when flowering, a bit like a Hydrangea paniculata (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrangea_paniculata)
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My point is that Trier *is* a "Hybrid 'Musk'", yet it is not listed as such. If you do an advanced search for "hybrid musks" you will *not* find Trier listed, while its offspring are. ...Meanwhile, the offspring are listed as being descended from "Trier (Hybrid Musk, Lambert 1904)" which is the only reason *they* fall into the HM category.
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I have changed the name to match the registered class of Hybrid Multiflora.
It seems that 'Trier' could be called a Hybrid Musk, Lambertiana, or Rambler, so have added those classes as well.
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Trier has rêve d or throught Aglaia , and hence Noisette blood and therefore a very distant Rosa Moschata origin. Trier is a Lambetiana and so should be called the Pembertons
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I cannot find "Mrs. Sharman Crawford", the rose that was intended to be Trier's male parent. Am I searching wrong?
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When you can't find anything, search with "contains" and a keyword. Try it with "contains" Sharman and you will find why you can't get to it.
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Thanks. Found it. Oh boy, that rose is more unfortunate than I anticipated. I am glad it failed so we have 'Trier' instead! Its such a good, easy rose. Mine is growing in a border of phlox and hydrangeas.
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When the description says almost thornless.... just how thornless is 'Trier' meant to be? Mine, from Misty Downs (Australia) is very thorny. Is 'Moonlight' thorny?
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#1 of 11 posted
9 JUN 13 by
Bernhard
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Hi Simon,
of course, just uploaded this pic:
http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=21.226943
cheers
Bernhard
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Danke Bernhard... the other photos of 'Trier' that show the stems also show plenty of thorns... the flowers on my 'Trier' seem to be smaller than the most recent photos show too.
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I too have uploaded photos of 'Trier', (and 'Moonlight' - and "Not Moonlight").
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I don't have any flower shots of my 'Trier' at the moment but my plant seems quite different to all your photos. The leaves look more narrow and multiflora-like and the flowers smaller.
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Mistydowns is no longer listing 'Trier' (that I could see), although it was in their 2005 catalogue as a Rambler. They may have realised they might have been selling something else as 'Trier' and taken it off the market.
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My Trier came from the then Thomson nursery in 2005, and I think their heritage roses came from Mistydowns. Prickles on mine are mainly on old stems, with a few on younger stems. The younger stems are burgundy at present.
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I bought mine from Misty Downs back in 2009-2010... can't remember which. I've taken some photos and uploaded them today.
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My 'Trier' has a couple of tiny clusters at the moment. Very young buds. The pedicels have distinct white hairs under a hand lens. I would like to note them on a mature bloom and I suspect they may be villose.
'Moonlight' seems to have smooth pedicels.
and "Not Moonlight" pedicel has tiny dark pedicellate glands.
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Like this: http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=21.227030
I noticed this downy look this afternoon.
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Not sure. I'll watch my buds for a few weeks until they are bigger and try to post a comparative photo.
In the meantime if anyone overseas has 'Trier' and a zoom lens.....a side on shot of the bud and pedicel would help a great deal.
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My 'Trier' has a hook every 4 inches of so. Easy to prune.
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JOURNAL OF THE ROYAL HORTICULTURAL SOCIETY 36: 529-533 (1911)
RAMBLING ROSES
By G. L. PAUL
'Trier,' says Mr. LAMBERT, is a seedling from 'Rêve d'Or.' 'Rêve d'Or' is probably the most rambling of all the Noisettes, but it is in essence a true Musk, showing that it has harked back to the common ancestor.
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