Joan, thanks to you, I'm going to change my order to Roses Unlimited before it's too late. The description of Spicy rose: Florist (means it needs ideal greenhouse & sheltered condition), plus "Thornless" plus Kordes rose, bred in Germany. "Florist" is the red-flag that warns people to stay away, unless they have ideal greenhouse condition. Bronze Star is a "Florist" rose, and that died on my 1st winter & other cold-zoners reported the same. Bronze Star needs constant wetness, as in a sheltered greenhouse.

I'm cautious about multiflora heritage, which gives dry & hot climate a hard-time. Multiflora likes loamy & acidic soil and high-rain climate. Multiflora gives roses its less-thorn trait and the blue color. I learned my lesson with own-root Kordes rose "Deep Purple", it's thornless and did fantastic in fluffy & neutral potting soil, plus tons of rain in spring. But the minute I planted in my heavy & alkaline clay, and the rain stopped, it's a nightmare, refused to bloom & diseased.

Although I'm temped by Kordes "Shocking Blue" & almost thornless & on sale for $12 at RU summer sale ... I realize that it has the same parentage as Deep Purple, which went downhill with alkaline tap water. With own-roots, there are 2 ways to avoid disappointment: 1) If it's vigorous enough to have deep root to withstand drought, and Kordes Poiseidon met that criteria, but NOT Deep Purple 2) if it's bred in the same soil and climate, Dr.Huey-rootstock was bred in California solves that problem, but with own-roots, it's much harder to find roses which were bred in similar soil and climate.

For own-roots, it's safer to go by whoever with SAME soil and climate's experience, rather than by the look alone. For that reason, I'm taking off pretty Louis Clements off my list, and hope to sub. for Sheila's perfume or Sutter's Gold. Louis Clements (bred in rainy & cool Oregon) died on a few California folks, but Sheila's perfume and Sutter's Gold can hand hot & dry. My summer is hotter than my 3 sisters in California, and Louis Clements most likely die in my summer heat, and in my extreme cold winter -20 F below zero. It's interesting that KBW from hot Pakistan (up to 113 F) and I have the same favorite roses ... roses that can survive extreme hot & dry have a better chance of surviving extreme cold winter.